Site logo

Porpoising a safety concern warns Russell

NEWS STORY
25/02/2022

While Mercedes has been affected by porpoising more than most, other teams are suffering the phenomenon which George Russell believes is a safety concern.

"I think you can see some quite substantial issues with the cars on the straights with the bottoming," said the Mercedes driver, who looks set to post the fastest time of the Barcelona test.

"So this is a compromise we need to find to go quickest around the lap," he added. "It's something I don't think any team has experienced before. We're seeing some interesting things out there.

"From what I've seen of other teams in particular, it would be a safety concern, so that does need to be sorted one way or another," he warned. "But there's a lot of intelligent people up and down this grid, and I'm sure everyone will get on top of it sooner than later."

"It's a whole new world and understanding that we need to get on top of, because it looks like it could be a topic for this year," added Carlos Sainz.

Check out our Friday gallery from Barcelona, here.

LATEST NEWS

more news >

RELATED ARTICLES

LATEST IMAGES

galleries >

  • Pitpass.com latest F1/Formula 1 images
  • Pitpass.com latest F1/Formula 1 images
  • Pitpass.com latest F1/Formula 1 images
  • Pitpass.com latest F1/Formula 1 images
  • Pitpass.com latest F1/Formula 1 images
  • Pitpass.com latest F1/Formula 1 images
  • Pitpass.com latest F1/Formula 1 images
  • Pitpass.com latest F1/Formula 1 images
  • Pitpass.com latest F1/Formula 1 images
  • Pitpass.com latest F1/Formula 1 images
  • Pitpass.com latest F1/Formula 1 images
  • Pitpass.com latest F1/Formula 1 images
  • Pitpass.com latest F1/Formula 1 images
  • Pitpass.com latest F1/Formula 1 images
  • Pitpass.com latest F1/Formula 1 images
  • Pitpass.com latest F1/Formula 1 images
  • Pitpass.com latest F1/Formula 1 images
  • Pitpass.com latest F1/Formula 1 images
  • Pitpass.com latest F1/Formula 1 images
  • Pitpass.com latest F1/Formula 1 images

POST A COMMENT

or Register for a Pitpass ID to have your say

Please note that all posts are reactively moderated and must adhere to the site's posting rules and etiquette.

Post your comment

READERS COMMENTS

 

1. Posted by alvarezh3, 27/02/2022 17:00

"@Spindoctor-
Upon further thought of the rolling belt effect on the wind-tunnel, perhaps the suction created by the venturi effect could be lifting the rolling belt (even without touching the under side of the tunnel) to the point where the results of the test on the wind-tunnel would become meaningless. The real road surface does not bent up with the suction created by the ventury, if it did, it would probably be so minimal it would not be of great influence in disallowing the downforce. Interesting."

Rating: Neutral (0)     Rate comment: Positive | NegativeReport this comment

2. Posted by alvarezh3, 27/02/2022 16:36

"@Editor
So true and sad: "those fateful elements that the sport now seeks to add by way of gimmicks."
"

Rating: Neutral (0)     Rate comment: Positive | NegativeReport this comment

3. Posted by Editor, 27/02/2022 16:04

"@ alvarezh3

Indeed, and it was such mistakes - missing a downshify for example - that added that extra element to the racing, those fateful elements that the sport now seeks to add by way of gimmicks."

Rating: Positive (1)     Rate comment: Positive | NegativeReport this comment

4. Posted by alvarezh3, 27/02/2022 15:22

"@Stitch431
Today's F1 drivers have it easy. In my days, in order to downshift, you had to left foot the clutch, right foot toe to the brake pedal and the heel to the throttle. All that while turning the steering wheel and operating the stick shift. Now they touch the paddle and it engages the clutch and synchronizes the engine speed to the transmission while an actuator moves the pinions inside the tranny. Almost impossible to miss a downshift.....NICE!"

Rating: Neutral (0)     Rate comment: Positive | NegativeReport this comment

5. Posted by alvarezh3, 27/02/2022 14:53

"@Spindoctor-
Thanks for the info."

Rating: Neutral (0)     Rate comment: Positive | NegativeReport this comment

6. Posted by Spindoctor, 27/02/2022 9:54

"@alvarezh3
My understanding is that owing to the design of wind-tunnels with a moving belt "road" the "cars" cannot be run at optimum low height: precisely for fear that any bottoming will damage the belt. Not sure where I gleaned this gem, but it does sound credible.

Looks like the team(s) which resolve this quickest are likely to be the ones at the front of the grid, at first anyway."

Rating: Neutral (0)     Rate comment: Positive | NegativeReport this comment

7. Posted by Stitch431, 27/02/2022 7:06

"Albon: These new cars slide faster, you can see more moving. Finesse is required to drive it. Maybe George should learn to adapt his style to the car. One of the goals of the new rules was that they were more difficult to drive. It seems to work :-)"

Rating: Positive (1)     Rate comment: Positive | NegativeReport this comment

8. Posted by alvarezh3, 26/02/2022 20:31

"It has been published that -by Friday afternoon- Binotto was a happier man do to almost eliminating all the purposing on the Ferrari. He has been quoted saying that "it was an issue but not anymore".

Sooner or later all teams will solve the bouncing. But, the teams that sooner eliminate the issue will initially most likely be higher up on the starting grid."

Rating: Neutral (0)     Rate comment: Positive | NegativeReport this comment

9. Posted by alvarezh3, 26/02/2022 16:29

"@ MossMan-

Additionally, perhaps running full size air molecules (only way) on a 60% scaled car on the wind-tunnel could also influence the results of the ventury effect on the tunnel that could ultimately show a wrong/improper (either way, or more, or less) vehicle behavior condition."

Rating: Neutral (0)     Rate comment: Positive | NegativeReport this comment

10. Posted by alvarezh3, 26/02/2022 15:41

"@ MossMan- Your description of the issue sounds reasonable and very credible.

Thank you for taking your time to give your explanation.

All the best."

Rating: Neutral (0)     Rate comment: Positive | NegativeReport this comment

11. Posted by MossMan, 26/02/2022 15:20

"@alvarezh3 - the reason this is less likely to show up in windtunnels (and especially CFM) is that it's a dynamic effect of feedback between the aero and the suspension... it's probably kicked off by a combination of chaotic input: turbulence, vibration from the road surface, deflections under manoeuver, etc.

People creating the CFM simulation will not think of every circumstance, windtunnels can only simulate relatively stable conditions."

Rating: Neutral (0)     Rate comment: Positive | NegativeReport this comment

12. Posted by alvarezh3, 26/02/2022 1:25

"@ Apexing

Understand your reasoning. In principle, it may work in diminishing porpoising, it would have to be confirmed by testing.
Unfortunately, that solution would also increase the weight of the car to the point where you would almost be guaranteed the last place on the starting grid. Maybe not worth to test. This apart from the fact that the rules no longer allow 6 wheeled vehicles.
Nice try though!"

Rating: Neutral (0)     Rate comment: Positive | NegativeReport this comment

13. Posted by Apexing, 25/02/2022 21:30

"@Mossman and @Superbird70 - using 6 wheeled cars would help. It would reduce the distance between the axles, adding stability to the cars! No more porpoising!!"

Rating: Positive (2)     Rate comment: Positive | NegativeReport this comment

14. Posted by alvarezh3, 25/02/2022 21:16

"The FIA did not design the tunnels and the it's surrounding structures for the teams to copy. Their car was a proof of concept to test and help them create the rules. Remember that the primary purpose of the new regulation was to to allow for cars to follow each other closely, and, acording to the drivers, this has now become a non-issue. Each team did its own work within the regulations, they are not all the same. Proof of this is that the degree of purposing is different between teams.
A friend of mine's mid eighties IMSA Lola GTP had purposing. It's something that has been bothering tunnel car designers for a long time and there are a host of remedies and combination of them to solve or minimize the issue to the point were it's not harmful nor dangerous and still do a useful job of creating downforce.
They have fixed it before and they will do it again. The inconvenience I see is that there is not much practice time to solve the problem, it's not like old times when you could test as much as you wanted.
What raises my curiosity is that apparently the issue is not (or almost not) easy to show up on the wind tunnel as I would think that if it did, it would of not shown the severity it has (on some teams) and that has taken them by surprise."

Rating: Positive (1)     Rate comment: Positive | NegativeReport this comment

15. Posted by Editor, 25/02/2022 16:22

"@ elsiebc

Courtesy of Ross Brawn and his chums."

Rating: Positive (3)     Rate comment: Positive | NegativeReport this comment

Share this page

X

Copyright © Pitpass 2002 - 2023. All rights reserved.

about us  |  advertise  |  contact  |  privacy & security  |  rss  |  terms