Hamilton/Massa incident

bewildered_jim · Posted: Mon Oct 31, 2011 09:31 Post subject: Hamilton/Massa incident

Two questions;

i) How was the incident in India different from Hamilton's move in Monaco on Maldonado?

ii) Some pundits like Andrew Benson are talking as though it was Massa's fault. Would they be doing so if Hamilton had been given the penalty? I.e. would anyone think that if Massa weren't given the penalty?
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MatCoch · Single-Seater Rookie Joined: 27 Mar 2010 Posts: 199

Given the penalty it suggests Massa was turning in earlier on that lap than the previous laps which, and I'm speculating here, the Stewards deemed to be crowding Hamilton off the circuit.

In saying that, I believe Hamilton could have done more to avoid it. He left it up to Massa to avoid having an incident, and given the history between the two, he was never likely to give Lewis an inch.

Podge 90 · F2 Racer Joined: 31 Mar 2010 Posts: 486

It was a tough one, because while Hamilton should have known Massa wouldn't have given way, Massa similarly should have known Hamilton wouldn't back out either.

Just seen the incident again on the news, and F'lippy did close the door on a car that was alongside; ye Hamilton wasn't in front, but that doesn't justify turning in regardless of whether or not a car has its wheels in front.

The way I see it is that Hamilton went for an overtake, so essentially he was saying 'turn in on me if you want, see what happens', whereas Massa was thinking 'I'm going in to turn in no matter what, see what happens'. So who is responsible for causing an avoidable collision? Down to interpretation I suppose. I just thought it was good to see someone (anyone) trying an overtake without the benefit of a kilometre long straight and DRS.

It was also worth it just to get that reaction from Rowan Atkinson too Very Happy

eduisfine · Posted: Mon Oct 31, 2011 14:21 Post subject:

If their encounter at Japan was deemed to be a racing incident, it's inconsistent to penalise Massa. IMHO Lewis had greater responsibility. A driver trying to pass must make it his business to realise when the gap is enough to make it through. Just sticking your nose next to the other car and hoping the other driver will back off, is just not good enough. Well it might be if you're Hamilton trying to bully Sutil or Perez, but lewis should know better than to think massa was going to let him get away with one like that (specially after what lewis had done to him at japan). Bad, bad driving from Lewis, bad, bad stewarding.

porscheman · Posted: Mon Oct 31, 2011 17:38 Post subject:

Massa had the last opportunity to avoid an accident. I believe that's what the stewards based their decision on.

Ash · F3 Racer Joined: 26 Mar 2011 Posts: 208

eduisfine · Posted: Mon Oct 31, 2011 19:44 Post subject:

easy_rider · F1 Driver Joined: 07 Mar 2005 Posts: 983

porscheman · Posted: Mon Oct 31, 2011 22:39 Post subject:

bawjohnson · F3 Racer Joined: 27 Mar 2011 Posts: 247

Perhaps Ferrai told him to "ruin Hamilton's race" again..?

Stranger things have happened Confused

Kismet · Posted: Tue Nov 01, 2011 01:08 Post subject:

Interesting the different perspectives each of us makes of the same incident. Watching the race with a friend of mine who raced motorcycles, he emphatically (being polite here!) stated Hamilton should have lifted. To me it appeared Massa just simply didn't see Hamilton.

The width of a race track is not enough for these two. Thankfully neither was hurt, although I'd suggest Massa's pride suffered a significant dent after his second round of self-induced suspension damage.

bewildered_jim · Posted: Tue Nov 01, 2011 02:23 Post subject:

I think Hamilton was ever - EVER so slightly more to blame (p = .080), but I'd attribute it to racing incident 7 days a week.

But why wasn't Hamilton and Maldonado a racing incident?
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MarkD · Posted: Tue Nov 01, 2011 13:32 Post subject:

In virtually any other motor racing series, if a driver can get at least halfway alongside and on the inside line for the approaching corner, then he is considered to have 'claimed' that corner and the other driver is (quite rightly in my opinion) expect to recognise this and leave room at the apex. So why is it apparently not so in F1? Confused

And as for all this, 'he couldn't see him in the mirrors' nonsense. Rolling Eyes

Do these drivers not have peripheral vision? Are they not aware that the bloke behind will be trying to get alongside? If it's really that big a problem then let the FIA introduce a rule about the size and placement of mirrors to remedy this apparent safety issue.
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Abb0nz · Posted: Tue Nov 01, 2011 19:05 Post subject:

bawjohnson · F3 Racer Joined: 27 Mar 2011 Posts: 247

Unstoppable force, immovable object- they're both idiots in my opinion.

Funny how Alonso and Webber can do it week in week out and not hit each other though isn't it?

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